"He remembers the sadness that felt like a sphere of dark water pressing down on his chest, making it hard to breathe, until it broke apart and poured into him so his whole body felt water-logged, and cold." - is one of those lines that captures an unspeakable and overwhelming feeling and mood so well. Just wonderful Ryan.
A few notes, drawing from a poverty perspective, which I've both grown up in and worked professionally in and think about constantly:
1) What looks the same and what looks different based on class in this society? IE: maybe everyone in the society is born with a rubaiyat. But are they different depending on your class somehow (shapes, presentation)? Or maybe everyone equally has one, but the rich shine brighter because they purchase clothing that accentuates it or the poor shine dimmer because they're tired. Or vice versa and wealthy try to make theirs demure and quiet with just edges showing and the poor folks' are brash. This came to mind with the description in the train car
2) Take or leave it as you like for narrative purposes...but I think its important to complicate depictions of poverty. Mixing in a description of a run down neighborhood with a provisional outdoor food-stall overflowing with good smells and a laughing group of eaters. A streetside game.
3) What they know vs what they learned and remember is an interested conversation in depictions like these. if Solis grew up amidst rickety bridges then that's what he knows and would not hate them, unless he had something very specific and terrible that he remembers and associates them with now. This applies more broadly to the tension in the story about escaping poverty and place. Solis can't truly hate the Chasm unless he hates himself or there was a dramatic trauma that forced him to flee it (possible! Was it what happened to Alito? maybe that feeling following that night spurred some dramatic action of some type that projected him out.) If not, then more likely he feels relief at having escaped the consequences and reality of the place, but also alienation because no matter where else he goes he'll not be able to connect with people who don't understand what it's like to grow up in the Chasm, also because in being elsewhere, he alienated himself from the his own community where nobody escapes. A return might mean judgment from his own people in that case and cause its own tension. It could also be a victory tour of the golden one that made it good. I think what the return means and feels like depends on the story Solis tells himself about how he escaped and what the story is in the community about that same event.
I knew you would have something insightful to say about fictional depictions of poverty. I actually think it's very rare for things in the sci-fi and fantasy spaces to depict poverty in a meaningful way. Mostly it's just cyberpunk, all dark and exploitative and afraid of some kind of "other".
I would really like to have a few more shades of meaning or nuance than that.
For the first point, I honestly hadn't even considered what looks different based on class (beyond, maybe, architecture) and you asking that question just fired my mind off in a bunch of directions. Absolutely need to start giving that some thought and finding some space to mention it in the writing.
For the second point, no you're right I am absolutely going to take that. Completely in agreement with how important that is.
And lastly... this is very much something it will pay to be mindful of. I have some conceptions of who Solis is and what his past is that are still mostly living in my head and haven't found their way to the page, so while I do have some answers in mind, none of those answers mean anything unless the narrative begins to show them (of course). I think that staying mindful of the difference between escaping poverty and escaping place will actually be really key to explaining the character. In brief, I am coming to view Solis as someone who joined a gang at a young age, developed a fear of heights and rickety bridges due to traumatic experiences as a youth, and that the only reason he escaped poverty was because he was arrested and put into a reformation program. So, keeping in mind the alienation that comes with being forcibly removed from one's place, but the relief that might come from feeling "rescued" from poverty could be a really good way to get Solis to show up on the page as a more real character.
Thank you, friend. I will never stop being grateful for your thoughts.
This is great! I think this is such a HUGE improvement already over the last version. The district really came to life in my eyes, and I'll say now that I want more of the weird right away. The weird stuff about this setting is so exciting, evocative, and gripping. Don't hide it!
One thing I would mention is to watch out for hedging: "If he or his little brother had been standing up they might have been hit." They WOULD have been hit. They would have died. Whether that is 'true' or not doesn't matter — our memories warp with time, and I can see Solis thinking of it any other way than as a sure thing, right?
Can't wait for more. The memory from Solid really helped characterize him, too, so it's nice to see that double duty being pulled.
Thank you Ty, it actually means a lot to hear you think it has improved.
As always a lot of your notes are really helping me out, and I think you are right again re: being definite and avoiding hedging.
This piece was also me trying to take to heart some other advice you gave me, which was to get inside Solis’s head more. Striving to do so has given me a lot of good changes and helped me find new directions.
As always I am deeply grateful for your advice. Thank you!
This is really beautifully written.
"He remembers the sadness that felt like a sphere of dark water pressing down on his chest, making it hard to breathe, until it broke apart and poured into him so his whole body felt water-logged, and cold." - is one of those lines that captures an unspeakable and overwhelming feeling and mood so well. Just wonderful Ryan.
A few notes, drawing from a poverty perspective, which I've both grown up in and worked professionally in and think about constantly:
1) What looks the same and what looks different based on class in this society? IE: maybe everyone in the society is born with a rubaiyat. But are they different depending on your class somehow (shapes, presentation)? Or maybe everyone equally has one, but the rich shine brighter because they purchase clothing that accentuates it or the poor shine dimmer because they're tired. Or vice versa and wealthy try to make theirs demure and quiet with just edges showing and the poor folks' are brash. This came to mind with the description in the train car
2) Take or leave it as you like for narrative purposes...but I think its important to complicate depictions of poverty. Mixing in a description of a run down neighborhood with a provisional outdoor food-stall overflowing with good smells and a laughing group of eaters. A streetside game.
3) What they know vs what they learned and remember is an interested conversation in depictions like these. if Solis grew up amidst rickety bridges then that's what he knows and would not hate them, unless he had something very specific and terrible that he remembers and associates them with now. This applies more broadly to the tension in the story about escaping poverty and place. Solis can't truly hate the Chasm unless he hates himself or there was a dramatic trauma that forced him to flee it (possible! Was it what happened to Alito? maybe that feeling following that night spurred some dramatic action of some type that projected him out.) If not, then more likely he feels relief at having escaped the consequences and reality of the place, but also alienation because no matter where else he goes he'll not be able to connect with people who don't understand what it's like to grow up in the Chasm, also because in being elsewhere, he alienated himself from the his own community where nobody escapes. A return might mean judgment from his own people in that case and cause its own tension. It could also be a victory tour of the golden one that made it good. I think what the return means and feels like depends on the story Solis tells himself about how he escaped and what the story is in the community about that same event.
I knew you would have something insightful to say about fictional depictions of poverty. I actually think it's very rare for things in the sci-fi and fantasy spaces to depict poverty in a meaningful way. Mostly it's just cyberpunk, all dark and exploitative and afraid of some kind of "other".
I would really like to have a few more shades of meaning or nuance than that.
For the first point, I honestly hadn't even considered what looks different based on class (beyond, maybe, architecture) and you asking that question just fired my mind off in a bunch of directions. Absolutely need to start giving that some thought and finding some space to mention it in the writing.
For the second point, no you're right I am absolutely going to take that. Completely in agreement with how important that is.
And lastly... this is very much something it will pay to be mindful of. I have some conceptions of who Solis is and what his past is that are still mostly living in my head and haven't found their way to the page, so while I do have some answers in mind, none of those answers mean anything unless the narrative begins to show them (of course). I think that staying mindful of the difference between escaping poverty and escaping place will actually be really key to explaining the character. In brief, I am coming to view Solis as someone who joined a gang at a young age, developed a fear of heights and rickety bridges due to traumatic experiences as a youth, and that the only reason he escaped poverty was because he was arrested and put into a reformation program. So, keeping in mind the alienation that comes with being forcibly removed from one's place, but the relief that might come from feeling "rescued" from poverty could be a really good way to get Solis to show up on the page as a more real character.
Thank you, friend. I will never stop being grateful for your thoughts.
This is great! I think this is such a HUGE improvement already over the last version. The district really came to life in my eyes, and I'll say now that I want more of the weird right away. The weird stuff about this setting is so exciting, evocative, and gripping. Don't hide it!
One thing I would mention is to watch out for hedging: "If he or his little brother had been standing up they might have been hit." They WOULD have been hit. They would have died. Whether that is 'true' or not doesn't matter — our memories warp with time, and I can see Solis thinking of it any other way than as a sure thing, right?
Can't wait for more. The memory from Solid really helped characterize him, too, so it's nice to see that double duty being pulled.
Thank you Ty, it actually means a lot to hear you think it has improved.
As always a lot of your notes are really helping me out, and I think you are right again re: being definite and avoiding hedging.
This piece was also me trying to take to heart some other advice you gave me, which was to get inside Solis’s head more. Striving to do so has given me a lot of good changes and helped me find new directions.
As always I am deeply grateful for your advice. Thank you!